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I read ‘s about the (in the parents’ forum) where parents were discussing the pressure to load up on AP classes. It was a good entry, and this was going to be a comment on it, but I decided that the comment would be too long. Because in addition to Ben’s entry, I read the thread. I did not know about College Confidential when I was applying to colleges, and this is probably a good thing because on the rare occasions I visit it, so much of what’s on it makes me angry or sad.
A bunch of the parents were very skeptical that you don’t need to pack your schedule with APs to get into a good school. You know, the reason APs help your application, as far as I can tell, is because they demonstrate your desire to challenge yourself and take risks (and also, I guess, because they can help explain a slightly lower GPA in some cases, not because they have magical properties. If you can otherwise demonstrate your desire to challenge yourself and take risks, you don’t “need” a bunch of APs.
Which doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t take them, just that you shouldn’t feel compelled. Some of the parents in the thread said that APs are important because of weighted grades and class rank. Um, assuming things haven’t changed that much since I did this, most college applications ask for your unweighted GPA, so the fact that your GPA is 26.2 on a 4.0 scale or whatever is utterly irrelevant.
I’m opposed to class rank, and my school was too and didn’t do it, but if you have an otherwise great application I think being ranked 20th instead of 5th in your graduating class is not going to hurt you. Ben’s entry made me smile because it reminded me of one of my stories (Ben, I think I told you this story). I took a lot of AP classes in high school. In fact, I took 14 of them, including 8 in one year. This was because, in general, the AP classes were better and more fun than the non-AP classes in non-artsy subjects (my school had performing and visual arts magnet programs) at my school. This allowed me to win a National AP Scholar award, win the AP State Scholar Award two years in a row, and get profiled in the city newspaper.
It was also an all-time record for my school. Now comes the funny part Honestly, I didn’t think much of this. I took these classes because they were good classes. But not everyone shared my opinion. In particular, the younger Asian and Indian kids (I hate to specify race/ethnicity, but it was mostly the Asian and Indian kids). They thought I was some sort of god.
They literally used to follow me around asking me odd questions. “How do you take so many AP classes?” “Do you ever have free time?” “Are you trying to finish high school a year early?” “How do you do it?” “Are you going to take every AP class?” This was kind of entertaining. And they would make odd comments. “My parents want me to take as many AP classes as you.” “My parents say I won’t get into a good school if I don’t take more AP classes.” “My parents blah blah blah APs blah blah blah be like you.” I found this very creepy, that I was apparently idolized by half the Asian parents of duPont Manual High. Seriously, everyone chill out.
I think the biggest benefit of my APs in terms of getting into college was that, combined with a few other things in my application, demonstrated that I was willing to take risks. I see posts on CC and comments on the blogs, and so many people are obsessed with statistics. My statistics were pretty good, but I’m sure a lot of you have/had better: GPA: 3.85 Class rank: N/A College classes: Creative Writing (an intro class), Medieval French Literature (a grad-level class) APs: seven 5s, five 4s, one 3, one 2 (in Calc BC, with a 4 on the AB subsectionyeah, that’s right, I got a 2 on AP Calc and I still got into MIT! I have already commented on most of this at Ben’s blogbut “I read Ben’s entry about the thread on College Confidential (in the parents’ forum) where parents were discussing the pressure to load up on AP classes. It was a good entry, and this was going to be a comment on it, but I decided that the comment would be too long.
Because in addition to Ben’s entry, I read the thread. I did not know about College Confidential when I was applying to colleges, and this is probably a good thing because on the rare occasions I visit it, so much of what’s on it makes me angry or sad.” I have to say I am inclined to agree there, I had not heard of it until I saw a reference in one of Ben’s posts (The one about MIT cheerleaders and his mother saying it made him sound like a dirty old man) so, I go read a few posts on the forumsit really just is not a pleasant atmosphere. People are becoming so caught up in. (I found your blog through McGann’s Factors, I believe) That’s nice that your school offered that many AP classes. My high school offers only about one class in each department. French, Spanish, Calculus AB, Environmental Science, English Lit, Government, and Music. And to top it all off, they only allow you into the AP class based on a recommendation from your previous teacher and you also pretty much have to be on the honors track in that department.
Which requires a recommendation from a previous teacher, and more classes than will physically fit into your schedule. So basically, it’s pretty much impossible to take more than a handful of AP courses I’ll only end up with 4 when I’m done with my senior year. Which looks like I’m not taking risks, but it’s not because I chose not to – it’s because my school simply won’t allow it. Not to mention the fact that I’m at a liberal-arts-type school, and the teachers think that a B is a very very good grade.grumble grumble. –Quentin.
You guys are real lucky to have advanced classes like that. Many of my classmates have already mastered the subjects we are currently taking but we cant take any higher level classes because our education system does not allow it. In primary school, I was able to follow a slightly advanced class because I was part of the school maths team and also have an encouraging teacher than often answer many of my curious questions. However, during my secondary school education, most teachers were trained to teach only what was required for the public examinations, PMR and SPM, and we had to follow the class schedule given to us by the school.
By the time I was in Form 2 (2nd year), I took outside tuitions for maths because I was bored with what was being taught in school. By that time, I was already learning what was supposed to be taught only in Form 4 and Form 5. Unfortunately, at the end of that year, my tuition teacher left for Australia. If we were to have such courses as AP in our education system, no doubt that most of my classmates would be doing that as we are totally bored with our current subjects. Most of us currently do our own researches online in the subjects that we are interested in. (this is one of the reasons I would like to study in MIT as one is free to choose any course he likes to study even though some of them has no relation to his major) I would definitely like to pursue my musical interests together with physics and maths (engineering).
My high school (which similarly did not do class rank, but didn’t do GPA either) is eliminating APs as fast as they can. US History got the axe before the year I would take it, and I was in the last class of Senior AP Literature.
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The math and language departments still like it, but the English and history departments have I think dumped all of them by now, and the science department basically teaches “AP classes” where they don’t teach to the curriculum and you have to study with outside sources to be prepared for the test. And it’s a better school for that. (also, dude, i never knew you did cross country.).
Attracting exceptional young scholars is a goal of most if not all universities. Exceptionally bright, motivated students who perform at high levels cultivate strong leaning experiences for university communities.
The students of many honors programs and colleges usually take the same classes as regular students. But, to the extent that students of honors colleges and programs are isolated among themselves – by way of exclusive classes or activities or living quarters – the overall benefits might accrue in isolation, while at the same time, can also be a drain on quality academic environment for the larger student population who otherwise would benefit from more interaction with exceptional students.
Further to that end, Michael Harris, in one of his blogs about his experience teaching in an honors college, expressed concern over a 'have and have-not' academic experience that honors programs tend to cultivate. Harris harbored another concern that some of the new-found (post-1960) enthusiasm over honors colleges and programs were driven more by consumerism, albeit a type of consumerism that was antithetical to altruistic efforts towards elevating learning experiences and academic excellence.